Kermit Gosnell

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Harlowe » Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:40 am

Partha wrote:
Fallakin Kuvari wrote: Personally I think God has his own plans -- maybe the life in the mother is meant to survive past her living and do great things; maybe they both survive and live on to do great things or be horrible people (same could be said for Rape/Incest -- but those are disgusting(though 2 wrongs also don't make a right)), maybe they both die tragically and the father goes on to do something he wouldn't have otherwise done... Who are we to make that decision?
With that attitude, we should just abolish hospitals. Fucked up nonsense isn't new coming from you, but this is a new lower level.
I agree with Partha that is some fucked up nonsense. Get rid of the medical care system entirely. Who needs doctors, medicine, vaccines etc, when God has a plan. Because who are we to extend life or health in the face of a higher beings plan.

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Fallakin Kuvari » Thu Apr 25, 2013 6:21 pm

Harlowe wrote:
Partha wrote:
Fallakin Kuvari wrote: Personally I think God has his own plans -- maybe the life in the mother is meant to survive past her living and do great things; maybe they both survive and live on to do great things or be horrible people (same could be said for Rape/Incest -- but those are disgusting(though 2 wrongs also don't make a right)), maybe they both die tragically and the father goes on to do something he wouldn't have otherwise done... Who are we to make that decision?
With that attitude, we should just abolish hospitals. Fucked up nonsense isn't new coming from you, but this is a new lower level.
I agree with Partha that is some fucked up nonsense. Get rid of the medical care system entirely. Who needs doctors, medicine, vaccines etc, when God has a plan. Because who are we to extend life or health in the face of a higher beings plan.
Not even close to what I meant, and you two just show how despicable you are to read that out of what I said.

You also reaffirm why I stopped posting in this particular forum.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Jarochai Alabaster » Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:48 am

Fallakin Kuvari wrote:
Harlowe wrote:
Partha wrote:
Fallakin Kuvari wrote: Personally I think God has his own plans -- maybe the life in the mother is meant to survive past her living and do great things; maybe they both survive and live on to do great things or be horrible people (same could be said for Rape/Incest -- but those are disgusting(though 2 wrongs also don't make a right)), maybe they both die tragically and the father goes on to do something he wouldn't have otherwise done... Who are we to make that decision?
With that attitude, we should just abolish hospitals. Fucked up nonsense isn't new coming from you, but this is a new lower level.
I agree with Partha that is some fucked up nonsense. Get rid of the medical care system entirely. Who needs doctors, medicine, vaccines etc, when God has a plan. Because who are we to extend life or health in the face of a higher beings plan.
Not even close to what I meant, and you two just show how despicable you are to read that out of what I said.

You also reaffirm why I stopped posting in this particular forum.
That is literally the only logical conclusion to be drawn from what you said. God has his own plan regarding peoples' lives and health, therefore why bother with medical care at all.

Maybe instead of getting butthurt you could explain how the conclusion everyone has drawn about what you said is wrong.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Arathena » Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:57 am

Fallakin Kuvari wrote:
Harlowe wrote:
Partha wrote:
Fallakin Kuvari wrote: Personally I think God has his own plans -- maybe the life in the mother is meant to survive past her living and do great things; maybe they both survive and live on to do great things or be horrible people (same could be said for Rape/Incest -- but those are disgusting(though 2 wrongs also don't make a right)), maybe they both die tragically and the father goes on to do something he wouldn't have otherwise done... Who are we to make that decision?
With that attitude, we should just abolish hospitals. Fucked up nonsense isn't new coming from you, but this is a new lower level.
I agree with Partha that is some fucked up nonsense. Get rid of the medical care system entirely. Who needs doctors, medicine, vaccines etc, when God has a plan. Because who are we to extend life or health in the face of a higher beings plan.
Not even close to what I meant, and you two just show how despicable you are to read that out of what I said.

You also reaffirm why I stopped posting in this particular forum.
You are rooting what you pretend to be ethics in hopeful benefits of evil. The entire world is worse for the existence of your statement, and I hope this lashing out is done in shame over being called on it.

I suggest that you go learn some morality from a textbook that does not detail the proper sale price of your daughter to her rapist.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Fallakin Kuvari » Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:21 am

What lashing out?

I made a statement about not posting in this particular forum because its true. This forum brings out the worst in all of us, myself included, because Politics is such a dividing topic nowadays. Look at how we all interact in the other boards then how we all interact here.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Massterloo » Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:57 am

Not politics -> Religion
Religion brings out the stupid in all it touches.

The remark "God's plan" is so open ended, that it's exactly what the ladies say you ment...and more.

Tag, you're it.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Harlowe » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:12 am

What lashing out, seriously? You constantly lash out dude. You are incredibly rigid, uptight and defensive.

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Harlowe » Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:35 am

Honestly, I don't mean to pick on you...but the whole "God's Will" thing is only used when it's convenient for the circumstance. I understand people being defensive when something they strongly believe in is attacked, but you really go on the personal attack when you are challenged.

Lots of us get into tiffs here over things we feel strongly about and someone often gets butthurt, but typically don't huff out of here. We challenge each other, that's kind of a healthy thing if you ask me - to be challenged over things we respond emotionally to.

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Fallakin Kuvari » Fri Apr 26, 2013 2:30 pm

Harlowe wrote:Honestly, I don't mean to pick on you...but the whole "God's Will" thing is only used when it's convenient for the circumstance.
I'll own that, because thats completely true. Thank you.
Harlowe wrote:I understand people being defensive when something they strongly believe in is attacked, but you really go on the personal attack when you are challenged.

Lots of us get into tiffs here over things we feel strongly about and someone often gets butthurt, but typically don't huff out of here. We challenge each other, that's kind of a healthy thing if you ask me - to be challenged over things we respond emotionally to.
I get challenging people; I just don't get the way we do it around here... some of us take the narrowest statement and apply it to the broadest stroke. I could understand if I had literally said "just let all cancer patients die because theres no cure, why even spend the money to prolong their lives?", but I didn't and thats not something I think is even be a valid argument -- its not like those people chose to get cancer.

On the flip side, Its not like those women that were raped made that choice to get raped and Abortion is a legitimate way to keep them from having to carry a baby they didn't want; Counter to that I just think its completely fucked up that you would kill a fetus (a growing human) just because you "don't want it" or "can't afford it". You made the decision to have unprotected sex, you made that decision knowing you could end up pregnant, but its "ok" because you can just kill the baby growing in you? Completely fucked up.

It gets completely more insane if you look into people like Margaret Sanger (who founded Planned Parenthood): http://www.dianedew.com/sanger.htm

Given that 6-8% of Pregnancies are "high-risk" and if you applied that number to the female population you'd have somewhere around 15mil people would could potentially die during childbirth; Yea, thats a significant number. I think it's certainly at their discretion if they would go forward with that pregnancy or not, but it should be a family decision. Personally my wife was borderline Pre-eclampsia during her last pregnancy; If she were to have issues this go round and the doctors told her that it could be unmanageable or that she would probably die, then (in my book) its her decision -- but we would seriously discuss it and talk about it as a family first.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Ddrak » Sat Apr 27, 2013 8:25 am

It's important to distinguish between legal rights and moral guidelines when talking abortion. The legal must contain all edge-cases, while the moral can have fuzzier boundaries.

On the Dianne Dew site - it's actually a highlight of what really pisses me off about a lot of the pro-life movement in that it very quickly goes off into SEX IS EVIL land. Check out the following ZOMG Planned Parenthood quotes on the page linked:
"We are not going to be an organization promoting celibacy or chastity."
"If your parents are stupid enough to deny you access to birth control, and you are under 18, you can get it on your own. Call Planned Parenthood."
"There are only 2 basic kinds of sex: sex with victims and sex without. Sex with victims is always wrong. Sex without is ALWAYS right."
"The question of whether or not to sell ourselves to men is a false one: The real question is how to sell ourselves in the way that is least destructive to ourselves and our sisters. Prostitutes don't need our condescension. What they need is our alliance. And we need theirs."
"Sex is too important to glop up with sentiment. If you feel sexy, for heaven's sake admit it to yourself. If the feeling and the tension bother you, you can masturbate. Masturbation cannot hurt you and it will make you feel more relaxed."
"At Planned Parenthood you can also get birth control without the consent or knowledge of your parents. So, if you are 14, 15 or 16 and you come to Planned Parenthood, we won't tell your parents you've been there. We swear we won't tell your parents."
I have zero problems with any of those statements. Teenagers are having sex. Hookers exist. Get the fuck over it already because NONE of them have anything to do with a pro-life position.

And let's face it, Dew's a nutjob anyway. Check out her death penalty links that appear to advocate Old Testament punishments: http://www.dianedew.com/dthpnlty.htm

Sanger was pretty nutty as well, don't get me wrong. The whole thing is ad hom anyway.

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Fallakin Kuvari » Sat Apr 27, 2013 8:42 am

Ddrak wrote: And let's face it, Dew's a nutjob anyway. Check out her death penalty links that appear to advocate Old Testament punishments: http://www.dianedew.com/dthpnlty.htm

Sanger was pretty nutty as well, don't get me wrong. The whole thing is ad hom anyway.

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Yeah, a few nutjobs populate the top of Google's search when looking for Sanger quotes on Abortion. Funny how that works.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Massterloo » Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:37 am

Then there was one vrs the world. Good luck Fal.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Partha » Sat Apr 27, 2013 3:58 pm

On the flip side, Its not like those women that were raped made that choice to get raped and Abortion is a legitimate way to keep them from having to carry a baby they didn't want; Counter to that I just think its completely fucked up that you would kill a fetus (a growing human) just because you "don't want it" or "can't afford it". You made the decision to have unprotected sex, you made that decision knowing you could end up pregnant, but its "ok" because you can just kill the baby growing in you? Completely fucked up.
Condoms break, IUD's sometimes don't work, and sometimes recessive genes pop out and your kid will be born without, say, a spinal column if you carry it to term.

God's plan, though, huh?

And this is one piece of whining I never get tired of hearing from butthurt 'conservatives' who like rooting around in vaginas:
I get challenging people; I just don't get the way we do it around here... some of us take the narrowest statement and apply it to the broadest stroke.
No one in the world forced you to type out your original premise on 'God's Will'. Your words are just that....YOUR WORDS. If you refuse to choose them carefully in a forum where body language, tone, and expression are denied you, then all you have is the words - so best choose them carefully. Choosing not to or getting mad when someone takes what you just typed and runs it to a logical conclusion isn't their fault, it's yours for being careless and borderline stupid.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Fallakin Kuvari » Sat Apr 27, 2013 8:20 pm

I'm sorry but I think its only fair when we're talking about one topic and something like that is said (and it hasn't come up in other threads where we're talking about genocide, mass murders or war), but it comes up in some other specific topic that we should probably err on the side of "that person is talking about this one specific topic".

We've all been around here for years. Its not like if we talked about Syria or Egypt and someone said "God's plan". Or we talked about Slavery and someone said "God's Plan". No I've said it once. Here. This is the only topic I would possibly say that on. The only reason I would say that on this topic is because the start of another HUMAN life is involved.

Condom's do break, thats why theres a morning after pill... If you choose to wait a month before you do something about it, then maybe you shouldn't be having sex in the first place.

IUD's sometimes don't work? What 1% of the time? I'm sorry, but the odds are ever in your favor not to get Pregnant while using an IUD. If you do, you should probably sit down and think that one over -- in my opinion there is probably someone upstairs telling you its time for you to have a(nother) kid -- If you already have many kids and you're only using an IUD, thats a choice you made knowing the risks (that theres a 1% chance of you getting pregnant) and you probably should've gotten your man spayed or your tubes tied.

Sometimes recessive genes do pop out and you will have a kid thats "different" -- that doesn't mean you should Abort them because of that, Partha Sanger.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Ddrak » Sat Apr 27, 2013 9:46 pm

If you refuse to choose them carefully in a forum where body language, tone, and expression are denied you, then all you have is the words - so best choose them carefully.
Nah, just retract and try to say what you mean better. Get much more respect for that.

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Massterloo » Sun Apr 28, 2013 2:48 am

FaL, you should have been aborted, cause you are far too "different" to survive on your own after those you have burdened pass away.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Partha » Sun Apr 28, 2013 4:58 am

Fallakin Kuvari wrote:I'm sorry but I think its only fair when we're talking about one topic and something like that is said (and it hasn't come up in other threads where we're talking about genocide, mass murders or war), but it comes up in some other specific topic that we should probably err on the side of "that person is talking about this one specific topic".
That does not change the point of what you claim to believe.
We've all been around here for years. Its not like if we talked about Syria or Egypt and someone said "God's plan". Or we talked about Slavery and someone said "God's Plan". No I've said it once. Here. This is the only topic I would possibly say that on. The only reason I would say that on this topic is because the start of another HUMAN life is involved.
So it's OK to set out to kill someone after they've lived a bit (see your comments in other threads regarding, say, Saddam), but if they're not even viable, it's wrong? Logic FAIL.
Condom's do break, thats why theres a morning after pill... If you choose to wait a month before you do something about it, then maybe you shouldn't be having sex in the first place.
Morning after pills are virtually the exact same thing as an abortion - it guarantees the impregnated ova doesn't implant. To pretend otherwise is folly.
IUD's sometimes don't work? What 1% of the time? I'm sorry, but the odds are ever in your favor not to get Pregnant while using an IUD. If you do, you should probably sit down and think that one over -- in my opinion there is probably someone upstairs telling you its time for you to have a(nother) kid -- If you already have many kids and you're only using an IUD, thats a choice you made knowing the risks (that theres a 1% chance of you getting pregnant) and you probably should've gotten your man spayed or your tubes tied.
Guess what? Those aren't 100% either, and I'm neither sadistic enough nor meddling enough to take the pleasure of sexual gratification away from females. I hope your wife doesn't read these forums.
Sometimes recessive genes do pop out and you will have a kid thats "different" -- that doesn't mean you should Abort them because of that, Partha Sanger.
So, you should, say, carry a child to term that will live in pain for the entirety of it's short life, or have such critical damage that it will never see, hear, or feel it's own mother - so you can feel good about your relationship with your Invisible Friend.

Gotcha.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Fallakin Kuvari » Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:03 am

Partha wrote:
Fallakin Kuvari wrote:I'm sorry but I think its only fair when we're talking about one topic and something like that is said (and it hasn't come up in other threads where we're talking about genocide, mass murders or war), but it comes up in some other specific topic that we should probably err on the side of "that person is talking about this one specific topic".
That does not change the point of what you claim to believe.
It merely specifies how I believe on this specific topic.
We've all been around here for years. Its not like if we talked about Syria or Egypt and someone said "God's plan". Or we talked about Slavery and someone said "God's Plan". No I've said it once. Here. This is the only topic I would possibly say that on. The only reason I would say that on this topic is because the start of another HUMAN life is involved.
So it's OK to set out to kill someone after they've lived a bit (see your comments in other threads regarding, say, Saddam), but if they're not even viable, it's wrong? Logic FAIL.
Yes. Its ok to kill a Mass Murderer for what they have done.
Condom's do break, thats why theres a morning after pill... If you choose to wait a month before you do something about it, then maybe you shouldn't be having sex in the first place.
Morning after pills are virtually the exact same thing as an abortion - it guarantees the impregnated ova doesn't implant. To pretend otherwise is folly.
I believe I even detailed that in this very thread.
And so you're not confused Plan B is actually "pregnancy prevention" much like birth control and that is why you need to take it in the first 1-5 days of the occurrence; It keeps the embryo from implanting, iirc. Its not RU-486, the "abortion pill" which is much more horrible.
IUD's sometimes don't work? What 1% of the time? I'm sorry, but the odds are ever in your favor not to get Pregnant while using an IUD. If you do, you should probably sit down and think that one over -- in my opinion there is probably someone upstairs telling you its time for you to have a(nother) kid -- If you already have many kids and you're only using an IUD, thats a choice you made knowing the risks (that theres a 1% chance of you getting pregnant) and you probably should've gotten your man spayed or your tubes tied.
Guess what? Those aren't 100% either, and I'm neither sadistic enough nor meddling enough to take the pleasure of sexual gratification away from females. I hope your wife doesn't read these forums.
A woman getting their tubes tied or a man getting "spayed" is a much more reliable method of preventing pregnancy than current forms of birth control. Again, everyone should be well aware of the risks their decisions entail.
Sometimes recessive genes do pop out and you will have a kid thats "different" -- that doesn't mean you should Abort them because of that, Partha Sanger.
So, you should, say, carry a child to term that will live in pain for the entirety of it's short life, or have such critical damage that it will never see, hear, or feel it's own mother - so you can feel good about your relationship with your Invisible Friend.

Gotcha.
There are always things to be learned from those children. Whether it be scientific or spiritual. Ways for them to better the world and ways to manage their pain. Just because they live a short time or cannot hear, see and/or speak does not make them any less of a life.
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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Ddrak » Fri May 03, 2013 8:00 am

[troll]

[/troll]

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Re: Kermit Gosnell

Post by Jarochai Alabaster » Fri May 03, 2013 12:45 pm

Ddrak wrote:[troll]

[/troll]

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